What if Packer fans graded the Vikings’ performance, and vice versa?

Packers Vikings Football

By Jake McCormick and Andy Weise

How do you force objectivity out of football fans? Our answer is simply to have them grade the team they love to hate. That’s what Packer fan Jake McCormick and Viking fan Andy Weise did as a follow up to Monday’s record-setting showdown between Green Bay and Minnesota. As it turns out, the only man with cameras on him, other than Ted Thompson and Mark Murphy, ended up living up to the highly anticipated hype as Brett Favre orchestrated possibly one of his best games ever. The Vikings left the Metrodome with more answers and the Packers left with more questions. Here are some of those inquiries we had about our respective nemesis’s:

Jake McCormick
Packer fan

Minnesota Vikings positional grades:

Packers Vikings FootballQuarterback
Grade: A
As much as I hate to say it, you can’t downgrade a guy one bit when he has recently had problems in big games, but goes 24-31 for 271 yards and three TDs against a team that two years ago considered him Jesus reincarnate. Oh yeah, he took home the NFC Offensive Player of the Week honors too. It was the first game with an opened up passing offense for Minnesota, which makes me wonder if this was promised to Favre before he signed…

Running back
Grade: C+
Adrian Peterson easily had his worst game of the season, but give credit to the Green Bay defense for game planning against him effectively. Peterson still had 25 carries and indirectly helped Favre throw the ball all over the field like a kid again. Have I heard that somewhere before?

Wide receiver/tight end
Grade: B
Also give credit to the Packer defense for only looking at Viking running plays during the week’s preparation. The Viking receivers did their jobs of catching balls in wide open space as the Packers blew their coverage assignments like it was a pickup game. As long as the ghost of Troy Williamson doesn’t return, the unit as a whole should continue to improve in their abilities and chemistry with Favre.

Offensive line
Grade: B+
According to ESPN, Favre had one pass play where he was given 7.34 seconds to throw the ball. The line didn’t allow a sack all game and Favre was sitting in his impenetrable space bubble all night. The usually dependable run blocking line did look overpowered at times as the Packers ran numerous run blitzes and sniper shots at AP. But eight men against five or six is a fair fight, isn’t it?

Packers Vikings FootballDefensive line
Grade: A
I think eight sacks speak for themselves. Granted the Packer offensive line nearly escorted the Viking pass rush to Aaron Rodgers, but Jared Allen looked like he would’ve gotten 4.5 sacks against any left tackle. The biggest strength of the Minnesota defense continued to shine, and will be crucial to its future success. As if that last statement was some sort of revelation; I sound like a Monday Night Football announcer.

Linebackers
Grade: B
Chad Greenway recovered a fumble and made a huge tackle on a goalline run by Packer fullback John Kuhn, and Ben Leber recorded a sack. EJ Henderson played well through the pain, and the unit did a good job of keeping Ryan Grant from getting to the next level. But the Packer tight ends were responsible for a good chunk of Aaron Rodgers’ 384 passing yards, and although he dropped the ball, Donald Lee was wide open for a touchdown on the Viking goalline.

Secondary
Grade: C-
This was the unit that was going to face the biggest test against the Packers, and it didn’t fail, but it barely passed. Antoine Winfield is the only consistent piece of the Minnesota secondary, and got credit for an interception that killed the Packers’ opening drive in Viking territory. Giving up 384 passing yards is never a good thing to put on a team’s resume, especially when the defensive line is severely pressuring the quarterback.

Overall, this was the first high pressure game of the year for Minnesota, and they won it with the typically strong defense and not so typical high octane passing game. The team will be riding on a golden chariot of confidence heading into this week’s matchup against the lowly St. Louis Rams. But the biggest tests this season come in the following weeks, before Favre’s just as highly anticipated return to Lambeau Field. I’ll bet that game becomes the highest rated Sunday game in league history if it’s broadcast nationally.

Andy Weise
Viking fan

Green Bay Packer grades:

Quarterback
Grade: A-
Aaron Rodgers is going to be a special player in the NFL for awhile. This wasn’t news to me but Rodgers proved himself as a franchise QB and the guy who deserved to take over the Packers over a year ago. He remained calm for much of the game even though his offensive line continued to crumble. He was most effective in the three step drop getting the ball quickly out of his hands but if he couldn’t find his first couple targets, he was generally getting hurried by some Viking.

Running back
Grade: C
Ryan Grant had an average game for a slightly above average running back against an above average run defense. Grant didn’t get the ball much once the Vikings took a two touchdown lead but he seemed to be doing OK when he was in before that. The Packers seem to have a drop off on third downs when Wynn goes in too.

Packers Vikings FootballWide receiver/tight end
Grade: B+
For the second week in a row the tight ends ran wild against the Vikings in the center of the field. Jordy Nelson also made it look easy down the middle when he scored on his touchdown. Greg Jennings and Donald Driver were relatively quiet being held under 100 yards combined with eight catches. The Vikings corners seemed to hold those two down but that’s when it opened things up for Jermichael Finley who went for 128 and a touchdown.

Offensive line
Grade: F
I knew this would be the difference in the game and it was. In four games the Packers have given up 20 sacks and Rodgers was brought down 8 times alone in the Vikings game. With Clifton out, Colledge struggled and T.J. Lang replaced him later because of injury only to look like a practice dummy as Jared Allen blew by him a few times (not always for a sack). Allen Barbre, who got a lot of flack earlier in the season, actually seemed to hold down a decent game but Jared Allen was attached to Rodgers for much of the game.

Defensive line
Grade: C-
Minnesota’s offensive line had given up sacks just like the Packers in the previous three games but somehow here they were able to block Green Bay from getting to Favre minus a couple of hits after the throw. Maybe the grade should be higher because they were able to stop Peterson in the running game but the lack of pressure on Favre was a big reason the Packers lost.

Packers Vikings FootballLinebackers
Grade: B
This unit was very active in the game, produced a big turnover that led to a touchdown and seemed to cover the field well when Peterson ran outside of the tackles. This was my first real chance to see how Aaron Kampman is transitioning and I have to say I was disappointed. While he does line up on the line sometimes, he’s not the same dangerous player he was when the Packers ran the 4-3.

Secondary
Grade: C
We all know Al Harris and Charles Woodson are probably the best duo in the league. They’re physical guys who battle every single play but didn’t come away with a good game. Harris was beaten badly on the Berrian touchdown though he ended up getting no help from the safety. He bit badly on Favre’s pump fake (how many times did I see that when he was in Green Bay, too many) and Woodson had a couple of costly penalties. The safeties didn’t factor in too much to the game.

The biggest thing I take away from this game is Aaron Rodgers really played a great game despite the horrible offensive line play. Packers’ fans have to be satisfied with that guy under center because the offensive line cannot get worse at this point. I’ve read Mark Tauscher might be coming back to take over at the right tackle spot he previously took care of and once Clifton is back they should be fine. It will be exciting to see Favre at Lambeau Field in a few weeks but I’m sure for now he is just happy to come away with the first win over his former team.

The Favre Exchange (featuring the Green Bay Packers and Minnesota Vikings)

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by David Kay and Peter Christian

Armageddon has arrived.

In my 28 years of sports fandom, I have never been more excited for a single beginning of the season-type of game like we will witness this evening.  Brett Favre plays AGAINST the Packers.  The subplots, quotes about how this is “just another” game, and revenge angles have been beaten into the ground.

Luckily, TSB.net resident Packer fan and Brett Favre apologist David Kay, and Vikings fan Peter Christian bring their own creative genius to this exchange to get you ready for tonight’s monumental Monday night showdown..

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(DK) Peter, when Brett Favre un-retired last season and ended up with the Jets, I was 100% for it.  The only worry I had was buying into all this talk about him tarnishing his legacy.  By crapping the bed at the end of last season (mainly because of a torn biceps muscle), I was ready to erase the Favre post-Packers Era from my mind forever.  Then last weekend happened.

Instead of tarnishing his legacy, Favre added another “WOW” moment by leading the Vikings to a come-from-behind victory in the final seconds of their game against the 49ers by avoiding a tackler, throwing the perfect ball to Greg Lewis in the back of the end zone who made an absolutely spectacular catch.

Before we can even dive into tonight’s game, you have to take me through the emotion of finally being on the right side of a Favre miracle… Feels pretty orgasmic, right?

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(PC) Wait, what? That was a miracle? I thought those were the types of  plays that any QB with an IQ greater than 15 can make, no?

Seriously though, it was an amazing play. I’m not even speaking in hyperbole when I say that was the greatest pass-catch combo in Vikings history. It felt super awesome knowing that the team had a passer that can make every throw instead of a guy who will throw it 10 rows deep into the stands when trying to hit his RB in the flats (yes Tarvaris, I’m talking about you).

Looking ahead to tonight’s game is there any way that the game can  live up to the hype? The real hype should take place prior to Favre’s  return to Lambeau, right?

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(DK) What?  You’re telling me Tavaris couldn’t have made that throw… Get the…

I fully expect tonight to live up to the hype.  Things will get chippy at some point.  Nick Barnett loves talking shiz and Favre has never been one to back down.  Barnett and Favre will get into at least one major jawing moment.  And I will love every minute of it.  Believe that.

You are right, it won’t have near the hype of Favre walking onto Lambeau in a Vikes jersey though.  I cannot wait to be standing on the field when that happens.  It will easily be the number one sports moment in my life and I will smile ear to ear when he gets booed mercilessly by the Packer faithful… not because I agree with them, but because the moment will be like an out of body experience.

The major question I have is whether Favre can stay within himself like he has done in the Vikes’ first three games.  Do you think he can keep his emotions in tact and not try to do too much and cost his team?

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(PC) Good God no. There is no way the same Brett Favre that has led the Vikings to a 3-0 record will be on the field tonight. He’s gonna be more jacked up than a 37 year old divorcee/cougar from Beloit at a hick bar listening to “Redneck Woman” after doing 3 cherry bomb shots and 2 body shots of tequila with the hairy dude sitting by himself at the bar.

However, that begs the question that is in the small quiet region of Vikings fans heads, “can 39 year old Favre tap into his youth or will he play like a geeked up 40 year old who can’t make every play but thinks he can?”

Personally, I hope that AD blows up for a huge game so Favre doesn’t have to do much but still gets the satisfaction of sticking it to Ted Thompson, who, let’s be honest, is the sole reason Favre is a Viking. As game time nears, what is your gut feeling on what takes place on the Mall of America Field at the Hubert H. Humphrey Metrodome tonight?

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(DK) My gut feeling is that AP runs wild on the Packers defense that has been soft against the run, especially up the middle.  If Cedric Benson and the Bengals can pound it on the Pack, I think AP will do likewise.

As for Favre, he will make at least one dumb throw early in the game that will have everyone thinking, “Crap, what the hell is he doing?”  But I think he wants to win this game to stick it to Ted Thompson and the Favre haters rather than try for some miracle repeat performance of the MNF game back in 2003 against Oakland, days after his father suddenly passed away when every ball he threw was spot on and miraculously caught.

For tonight, I’m going Vikings 27, Packers 20.  Green Bay’s offensive line is bad.  Their running game sucks.  Neither are encouraging signs when the Williams’ and Jared Allen are up-front for the Vikes… To quote Tony Kornheiser, “Who you got?”

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(PC) I’ve got a headache, that’s what I’ve got. I’ve got about 17 invitations to watch the game over at people’s houses or at some sports bar. I’ve got only a couple of hours until this anticipation becomes real and I have to start living the rest of my life. OK, that last one sounded way less pathetic when it was running through my mind. As for the game, I’m sticking to my guns. I was really surprised at how terrible the Packers offensive line was in week 1 and they haven’t gotten any better. If anything, they’re worse because veteran tackle and anchor Chad Clifton is sitting this contest out. Throw in the aforementioned Williams Wall and Jared Allen (the best front unit the Pack has seen thus far) and it is gonna be ugly for Aaron Rodgers. I know he could dissect the Vikings safeties if he had time, but that is a luxury he won’t have. I envision a mediocre Brett Favre game (1-2 TD’s, 2 INT’s) but an outstanding game by Purple Jesus himself. Vikes take it 31-10 and the home team prevails in the Metrodome for the 4th night in a row.

I only wish I could make this game last forever…

In Their Own Words: Madden on Vikings vs. Packers

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By Melissa S. Wollering

While Brett Favre was waffling this off-season, I, John Madden, was eating waffles with maple syrup and little chocolate sprinkles over whipped cream out of that aerosol can thingy. Oh, and I also made people believe my retirement was linked to my ability to never again commentate with Brett Favre at the helm of an NFL team.  Boy, was I wrong.  You know what I’m still right about?  Ace is the place for hardware. And the road to Easy Street goes through the sewer.

Many people believed I would come back to announce only if Favre came back to play.  You know who spread that rumor? The guy who came back to host a primetime version of his Tonight Show on the same network that moved MNF to its sister network and settled for football on Sunday nights.  Now Football Night in America has a bunch of idiots representing them at one desk. I like Tony Dungy, but who thought that putting Costas, Patrick, Olbermann and Harrison together was smart? Gee, don’t worry about the horse being blind, just load the wagon. [Read more…]

Packers-Vikings exchange: No added hype necessary

Favre then and now

By Jake McCormick and Andy Weise

Depending on where you stand for Monday night’s impending ratings record-setting matchup between the Minnesota Vikings and Green Bay Packers, you will either be throwing up or cheering by halftime. Or both. This of course will stem from the Monday Night Football announcers breaking John Madden’s streak of constantly mentioning Brett Favre and all his clichés. But unfortunately, it is unstoppable and there is a reason to their full game, broken record talking points.

It will be the Bourne movies brought to life: A man left for dead, coming back to hunt down those who have (supposedly) done him wrong. Throw in a little Star Wars in that he was a pioneer in saving the Packers, only to flip sides like Anakin, and you have Monday night’s game. The 97th meeting between teams whose fans “love to hate” each other will be the most entertaining in Packer-Viking history just because of that storyline. Whatever side you’re on, just enjoy the fact that we will probably never see something like this again in the NFL (at least until Week 8).

In honor of this increasingly hyped matchup, TSB Packer fan Jake McCormick and Viking fan Andy Weise are resurrecting their working relationship from their days at UW-Eau Claire to answer questions, provided by the opposing writer, about their team heading into the game.

Since the Packers have more overall issues, they need to be addressed first:

Andy Weise: How have the Packers adjusted to the 3-4? (*Note, if you can get specific with players like Kampman and Hawk and the D-Line as a whole).Do they think it hurts them that a lot of teams the Vikings and Bears are playing this year also have the 3-4 (49ers, Steelers, Browns, Ravens etc)?

Packers Rams FootballJake McCormick: They’re coming along about as fast as you would expect at this point in the season, meaning there’s a lot of questions remaining that probably won’t be answered for a few more weeks or even until next season. I mentioned a quote from a Chicago sports radio host in a previous Packer article that said, “You don’t need the ‘right’ personnel for the 3-4 if you have smart enough players to run it.” I’m really not worried about the other NFC North teams playing 3-4 defenses, because as with the 4-3, every scheme is dependant on the coach. With Dom Capers, the Packers have one of the best 3-4 schemers in the game and he’ll definitely find a way to bring out a few surprises.

Aaron Kampman popped his linebacker cherry against St. Louis with a sack and knockout of QB Marc Bulger. He was consistently around the ball and looks like he’s growing into the position. The rest of the linebackers look like they’re taking a little more time to grasp the scheme.

I’m happy with the way the defensive line has been playing. Cullen Jenkins and Johnny Jolly have looked pretty good in spurts. The unit is very thin, and BJ Raji’s debut wasn’t show-stopping, but he should be much more of a factor against the Vikings.

AW: Is Aaron Rodgers the real deal? He seems to be but how good can he really get? Do the fans feel like they have another Favre, 15 more years as the starting QB or what are the expectations at this point?

Packers Rams FootballJM: Aaron Rodgers will be an elite quarterback by season’s end. He already proved he can perform in pressure situations, and despite running for his life on every other play, he doesn’t make mistakes. As a Packer fan, when the offensive line has been suspect in the past, I would fully expect a forced throw and interception. Rodgers is extremely smart with the ball while still being able to make any throw he needs. Just like the Minnesota Twins and managers in baseball, the Packers look like they are set for quite a while with Rodgers under center. That is provided he doesn’t get severely injured, of course.

AW: Grade Ted Thompson and Mike McCarthy. Are these guys safe if the Packers don’t make the playoffs? It seems like all the experts were pretty high on this team so if they disappoint, who does that fall on?

JM: I think it’s too early to grade any coach/GM for the season. I would guess that if the Packers don’t make the playoffs, both will be on the hot seat for next season, although in the NFL there is rarely such a thing as a “cold seat.” Why not this year? Mostly because they overhauled the entire defensive coaching staff and they are young enough where they don’t have a Vikings-like “win now” philosophy. The defense is expected to struggle, but if the offense doesn’t put up points and subsequently can’t win games or show some overall improvement, then the failure will rightfully be on McCarthy and Thompson. I’d give them another year, and then throw down the gauntlet after 2010 if Green Bay flops.

AW: Will Packers fans ever forgive Brett Favre for coming to the Vikings? I would think if he loses to them twice that would heal some of the wounds but I’m sure most will never forgive or forget. What’s your take?

JM: Short answer: Yes, but it will take time. To quote George Harrison: A whole lot of precious time. I know that in the grand scheme of things, this whole episode will be forgotten in about four years. Or if the Packers win a Super Bowl, Favre embarrasses himself again, or we sweep; whichever comes first. It’ll probably play our like Star Wars, where it took until the last possible second for Darth Vader to return to the light side. I wouldn’t count on Favre tossing Emperor Childress over a ledge, though. I’m not sure exactly when I’ll forgive the Fallen One, but I’m open to it at some point. Forgiving Brett Favre is to Packer fans as steroid users are to baseball fans. I will really enjoy cheering against him though. Like REALLY enjoy it, like you used to.

Halftime! Nipple slip by the Boss! Vikings ball:

JM: The Vikings have been a second half team so far this season. That bodes well against teams like Detroit and Cleveland, but are you concerned about their slow starts coming back to haunt them against better competition?

49ers Vikings FootballAW: Any team should be concerned if they start slow but with the Vikings because they rely heavily on the run, it’s always a concern when they get behind early. They started off better against the 49ers last week and because of the rare blocked field goal returned for a touchdown, they actually trailed going into the first half instead of leading by six or nine points. One thing is for sure, the Vikings and most of their fans are a lot more comfortable when the team has trailed this year because of that new quarterback they have.

JM: The Viking pass defense was its Achilles heel last year. Even though they are ranked fourth against the pass so far, I wouldn’t call Brady Quinn, Matt Stafford, or Shaun Hill anything other than projects. The Packer passing offense will definitely be a test, but is this secondary for real behind Antoine Winfield?

AW: There are more questions than answers at this point. I doubted Darren Sharper last year and so far I think the Vikings miss him a lot more than expected. The safeties in Madieu Williams and Tyrell Johnson are easily the weak point of the defense and they were exposed last week against the 49ers when Vernon Davis got into the endzone twice. Outside of Antoine Winfield, cornerbacks Cedric Griffin and Benny Sapp are solid players who hit hard but aren’t always reliable in coverage. Overall, the pass defense gets a huge boost when pressure is created by the front seven.

JM: Its no secret that the Packer offensive line has pass protection problems, giving up 12 sacks in three games. However, the Viking’s line has been less than stellar in that category as well, giving up 9 sacks. Is this a cause for concern, given the guy under center?

AW: I think there’s reason for concern but the new center John Sullivan has actually done very well. He got smoked in the first game by Shaun Rogers when they were one-on-one but otherwise he has done just fine. Most of the sacks have come off the ends when the tackles, Phil Loadholt and Bryant McKinnie have let their guys by them. Favre has probably held the ball too long at some points too but I think he’s taken some sacks at times when he probably could have thrown the ball away. It’s almost as if Brad Childress and Darrell Bevell have told him the best thing he can do at some points when the pressure comes is to go down with the ball. It’s no secret that Favre has been turnover prone during the course of his career and so far one turnover in three games has been pretty positive.

JM: Here’s my Favre question: it seems like the Vikings’ season will not be a success if they don’t make it to at least the NFC championship game. Are you at all worried about what the Vikings will look like in a year when he retires? I know this is a win now league, but are you just going to be happy with a playoff trip from a rental, a la CC Sabathia and the Brewers last year?

AW: Were the Brewers happy just to get to the playoffs? The answer is no for the Vikings. Is this season championship or bust? Probably.

The thing about Favre playing this year and maybe only this year is he improves the team. There’s no way that people have confidence in Tarvaris Jackson or Sage Rosenfels to lead the team down the field with a 1:30 left and no timeouts like Favre did last weekend. Favre was an upgrade over the situation in the beginning of training camp and if he is here for one season, the Vikings still have Rosenfels, the draft and free agency to decide what they want to do next year.

49ers Vikings FootballOwner Zygi Wilf is clearly committed to winning and will bring in whatever it takes to put the best possible team on the field. The other thing that helps for the Vikings next year is there’s a lot of quarterbacks names floating around with the NFL draft next year. The success of Joe Flacco, Matt Ryan, Mark Sanchez and even Matthew Stafford (hey, he won a game right???) has to put confidence in teams drafting rookie quarterbacks. Ryan, Flacco and Sanchez all could be in the playoffs this year and that’s generally because they’re on teams with good veteran leadership and/or good coaching. So in long, the Vikings are clearly trying to win a Super Bowl and though I’m not convinced this early in the season, we are talking about Brett Favre here. As Kevin Garnett once said, “Anything is possibleeeeeeeeeeeeee!”

Andy’s prediction:
The game will be close. Vikings by a touchdown.

Jake’s prediction:
*Insert synonym for Andy’s first sentence.* I really hate to say it, but the Vikings are too good at this point in the season and will win by less than seven points. I hope I’m wrong.